Honda in WRC

[Spider Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Spider]

O fi poate un plan de viitor asa cum ei au probleme venind in totdeuna tirziu la petreceri.

Da dar aduc cu ei cel mai bun dj dupa cautari ce au durat ceva vreme si iarasi se fac remarcati si apreciati.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

sa continuam cu traditia si experienta lui Honda cu sisteme awd/4wd/4x4

"For 1987, the four-wheel-drive (4WD) system for the Civic wagon was revised. "Real Time" 4WD automatically channeled power to the wheels that had optimum grip and did away with the driver having to decide (and then move a lever) if four-wheel drive was needed."

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...rticleId=68272

culmea ca e chiar pe civic.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

si traditia cu turbo:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_City_Turbo

http://dwolsten.tripod.com/articles/jan89a.html

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

never say never.


deci cam asa statea situatia in 2002.


"Honda Wary of Building V8, Chief Engineer Says

By: Norihiko Shirouzu, Staff Reporter of The Wall Street Journal

LOS ANGELES -- A senior Honda Motor Co . executive said the No. 2 Japanese auto maker likely won't build a V8 engine unless it could improve the engine's fuel economy and emissions beyond the industry's norm.

He said one way to address the lack of V8 powertrain options in Honda vehicles may be to create a propulsion system that combines a V6 engine with an electric motor to offer V8-like power.

Tomoyuki Sugiyama, an executive chief engineer of Honda's research arm in Japan , said in an interview here that Honda remains apprehensive about making a V8 engine if it is the kind that guzzles gas.

Some Honda dealers have been asking Honda to offer V8 engines, but the company has insisted that its sales of full-size vehicles aren't large enough to justify a new family of big engines. Other dealers also want Honda to build pickup trucks, a move that could justify developing a V8 engine. Honda admits it has " studied" the possibility of developing pickup trucks, but Yuzuru Matsuno, a Honda spokesman in Detroit , said the auto maker hasn't made a final decision on the possibility. Honda isn't likely to enter the pickup-truck market any time soon, he added.

Mr. Sugiyama said that as a corporate strategy, Honda "tries to put a higher priority on safety and environmental friendliness" over sheer power. "We won't likely develop V8 engines unless we can come up with a technical solution to their fuel economy and emissions" and make them a standout in the industry.

One solution the company is considering, Mr. Sugiyama said, is to try to create a V6 engine that can put out V8-like power, instead of trying to develop a cleaner and more economical V8 powertrain.

"That's one direction we could take," he said.

-Norihiko Shirouzu, The Wall Street Journal; 313-510-5886"


primul pas sa realizat. cei care ziceau ca Honda nu va face un pick up truck au fost surprinsi.
Cind o sa fim oare cu totii surprinsi de un V8?

deci, din nou, nu as spune ca este imposibil si ca nu vor face un anume produs (mai ales ca nu stiu pe ce sa ma bazez cind spun asta).




si apoi intervine Fukui si zice:


http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=106731

si

http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=386801


Honda deja are un V8 care merge foarte bine. In INDY.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

stiri proaspete!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



http://www.wrc.com/page/Home/0,,10111,00.html

sau apasati pe HOME, pe site daca nu intra direct.

[jester Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close jester]

daca nu vreti sa va inregistrati ca sa citit articolul:

Honda at last!

For the first time ever, the FIA World Rally Championship has a Honda car registered as a championship contender! Nominated by the organisers as the official "Guest" driver in the Junior World Rally Championship category on the Neste Oil Rally Finland, Matti Rantanen will be at the wheel of a Honda Type R. Rantanen won the 2-litre Group N class on the 2005 event, and has twice won this class in 2006 national championship events.

Although frequently seen in the hands of privateers, Hondas have not been involved either directly or indirectly as official registered championship competitors before.

Another Finn entered in his country's WRC event in the J-WRC category is Kalle Pinomaki, currently the leader of the new 'Rookie' championship. For this event, he forsakes the Group N Renault Clio which he has driven in Sweden, Spain and Corsica for a full Super 1600 Renault Clio for the first time.

The Rookie series is restricted to drivers at the wheel of Group N cars in the J-WRC. A spokesman for the promoters of the J-WRC has confirmed that Pinomaki will retain the Rookie points acquired in previous events but cannot score Rookie points in Finland. He is to drive his usual Group N Clio on the preceding rally in Germany.

[HondaCBR Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close HondaCBR]

in sfarsit =D>

[jester Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close jester]

da' ce masina e aia Honda Type R?

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

multumesc Jester.

o fi ITR, CTR, etc. ramine de vazut.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

http://www.myflow.de/bilder/bilder/rally/rally11.jpg

http://www.myflow.de/bilder/bilder/rally/rally07.jpg

http://www.bensonsauto.lv/images/text/Laukaa_Rally.jpg

asta imi place:

http://www.bensonsauto.lv/images/text/Simkus.jpg

[Dannu Member Find all posts View Profile Close Dannu]

Ar fi excelent dar eu tot cred ca mai avem de asteptat...

[Guest Close BogdanRR]

Nu e o noutate asa mare, CTR alearga prin campionate de raliu de mult timp. Acum, doar ca s-a implicat fabrica direct in JWRC.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

flip flop.

[dixy2k Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dixy2k]

Filozofia Honda nu sta in motoare turbo in 4 cilindrii nicidecum. Departe de Honda treaba asta.

2.3-ul ala turbo nu e nicidecum facut pt alergatura, ci doar pt ca au considerat ca s-a ajuns la un nivel tehnologic destul de bun cu 4inline turbo incat sa intreaca V6-ele aspirat din multe puncte de vedere.

ambele luate din acelasi post.

Si, ca sa aduci din punctele astea de vedere tehnologia la acelasi nivel cu ceilalti, iti trebuie o caruta de bani.
Prin urmare, in al doilea rand, nu prea ar exista castiguri financiare, mai ales ca in WRC nu se invart prea multi bani.

deci de ce ar trebui asa de multi bani daca nu e nevoie de ei?
sponsorii ce fac in cazul asta?

Eu nu cred ca se merita sa se bage in asa ceva.
In primul rand, experienta in motoare turbo si sisteme AWD lasa de dorit (chiar daca exista acum SH-AWD, eu vb de experienta, mult mai importanta).

deci citeste mai sus si documenteazate.

Iti recomand, totusi, sa te informezi asupra filozofiei Honda in ceea ce priveste racing-ul. Adevaratii fani Honda apreciaza modelele sportive ale marcii tocmai pt ceea ce sunt si n-am mai auzit pe nici un fan adevarat Honda sa propuna ce propui tu.

ai intilni multi?

Sa afirmi sus si tare ca Honda ar trebui sa intre in WRC si, mai ales(!!!), pe felia de piata auto a lui Subaru si Mitsu cu un sport sedan AWD turbo, e de-a dreptul hilar si trist in acelasi timp.

2009 e prea departe si iesit din discutie?

Am vazut destul de multe filme cu comportamentele haotice ale Civic-urilor cu turbo ca sa incerci sa ma convingi de altceva. Pe linie dreapta rulz(pana la urma, ce masina n-ar fi 'queen' pe linie dreapta cu ditamaia turbo sau bi-turbo si 5 butelii de NOS?), in schimb nici vorba de echilibru in viraje sau mai stiu eu ce. Torque cu galeata, ca de restul nu ne pasa.

5 butelii puse la fiecare roata poate, inclusiv cea de rezerva. unde e legatura intre suspensie si supralimentare? turbina nu se pune la suspensie.

Dar eu vreau sportiva N/A, de turatii mari, usor de manevrat si echilibrata in acceleratii, nu vreau bruta de WRC care sa-mi faca fractura de coloana.

deci tie frica sa conduci. vezi ca exista si Buick de vinzare. se potriveste perfect descriptiei tale.

Stai linistit, ca nu viseaza nimeni WRC asa de des, mai degraba F1 decat WRC. Honda face masini de strada sportive excelente deja, pe felia ei de piata e imbatabila (sportive compacte FWD), deci si motivul asta scartaie rau.

mai esti inca de aceeasi parere?

Aceasta marca isi are limitele ei, ca oricare alta. Aceasta marca are o anumita filozofie de racing. Aceasta marca NU are experienta in motoare turbo. Punct. Daca sunt fan Honda, inseamna ca trebuie sa fiu orb si sa nu vad limitele ei?

:lol: :lol: wow. cunosti istoria lor mai bine decit ei o stiu.
Ai vazut deja limitele Honda? Leai gasit unde sau blocat mental?

Tot nu mi-ai raspuns, cu ce ar ajuta imaginea si filozofia Honda participarea in WRC? Si, mai mult decat atat, de unde atatia bani pt F1 si pt WRC? Vezi tu Subi, Mitsu, Citroen, Peugeot in F1? Vezi tu Toyota, Mercedes, Renault, BMW in WRC (mai ales BMW)? Nimeni nu poate suporta o cheltiuala asa de mare.

iar o dam cu finantele? o cursa de F1 consuma cit 2 ani in WRC.
Mai esti inca de aceeasi parere acum?


flip flopper sau dezimformat?

[Guest Close BogdanRR]

Ai vazut si tu o stire cu 4sport ca se va fabrica in 2009 si deja te-ai excitat tot. :lol:

Deci pe rand:

1. filozofia RACING de la Honda nu e legata de turbo AWD. Honda a mai facut motoare turbo, si inca face, vezi key-cars. Asta nu inseamna ca vei vedea un Civic sedan awd turbo in curand.
2. de cand s-a inventat sistemul "sponsor ofera bani Honda pt a realiza o masina WRC"? Penibila afirmatie asta cu sponsorii. Sponsorii nu fac decat sa sustina o echipa privata cu o masina gata facuta, de la mama ei.
3. da, am intalnit ceva fani Honda ADEVARATI, care inteleg filozofia de racing Honda...nu asa-zisii 'fani' care vor V8 si RWD pe Honda. Aia nu-s fani, aia-s "emblemisti", adica disperati dupa marca si nu dupa masini in sine. E plina America de ei, din ce-am vazut. Probabil, te-ai molipsit de la ei. Si aici se manifesta "emblemismul", multi proprietari de Dacia isi trantesc embleme de BMW.
4. ai vazut tu vreo stire ca intra Honda in WRC in 2009 cu un model complet nou??? Oau! Da-mi-o, s-o vad...again, te-ai excitat la 3-4 randuri de stire bazata pe barfe si speculatii.
5. cand masina e doar FWD, si e excesiv de mult cuplu, acceleratia la iesirea din viraje e compromisa total. Daca nu stii asta, invata sa conduci.
6. Frica sa conduc??? tragi concluzii doar ca sa te afli in treaba...poate ii intrebi si pe baietii de aici care au fost cu mine ce frica imi e sa conduc :lol: again, cand ai sa conduci si tu sportiv, mai vorbim. A merge pe interstate cu 80-100mph nu inseamna sportivitate. La voi acolo vad ca s-au desfiintat de tot drumurile virajate sau circuite, vedeti in fata ochilor doar linii drepte si ovaluri tip Indy. Daca nu stii ca un cuplu mai modest pus pe asfalt in mod echilibrat si progresiv ajuta la mersul accelerat in viraje, si nu un ditamai cuplul pe FWD/RWD, again, ai carnetul de sofer degeaba. (ai vazut cum se misca un S15 de 400cp turbo RWD fata de un S2K de 250cp RWD pe viraje, pe Togue).
Cand o sa deschid firma de pompe funebre, imi iau si Buick.
7. Vorbeam de limitele ei financiare. Daca tu crezi ca Honda are un sac fara fund pt motorsport, ai dormit pana acum in Wonderland. Trezirea!
8. exact, o cursa de F1 consuma enorm. Bugetul motorsport Honda se axeaza acum pe F1, deci bani pt masina WRC, din parti. Tocmai ti-ai dat singur raspunsul...

Ok, asa e, sunt flip flopper si dezinformat, dar macar nu dansez printre nori inconjurat de V8-uri, WRC si RWD made by Honda...

Si ca sa citez un clasic in devenire: "Opel nu e GM pt ca nu are suruburile facute in Alabama". Flip flopper? Dezinformat? Hmm, oare ce sa fie?